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*Head desk*
Flash
lil_shepherd
I have just been told, elsewhere on LJ, that the Gnu atheists (and people like me) are committing low level persecution of theists (and, of course, Christians in particular) by actually daring to state that there is the same lack of evidence for their god as there is for all other supernatural beings.

Persecution? Next it'll be hate speech!

I'm afraid I was very rude. I really should resist the temptation to bait theists and accommodationists...

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Good.

Poor, delicate little dears seem to overlook the fact that they've persecuted all manner of minority groups for thousands of years. Taste of their own medicine time. Except that it's not persecution but instead a wholly reasonable challenge to their idiotic views.

Paranoid or what? *g*

I'm afraid my reply started, "Poor liddle theists..." and went on from there. It did not help that this particular person who, unfortunately, I do know personally but very distantly, was trotting out the old accommodationist arguments, and I am rather up on the counters to those, cos I read Ophelia Benson and Jerry Coyne...

Well, Good Lord! I am a theist - I believe in lots of them. But although there's evidence that satisfies me on a subjective basis, I certainly won't attempt to convince others. There's a lot of Major Group Whinging around at the moment: we're white, rich, Christian and privileged and YOU'RE BEING NASTY TO US!

I don't seem to have the religious gene - I think it may be something to do with not being able to connect terribly well with my fellow human beings, either. *grin*

I am happy not to try to convert anyone who doesn't try to convert me - and who doesn't want to impose their particular dogma on anyone else. Hence I get on very well with most pagans, and Unitarians, and Quakers, and Deists, come to that. But Christianity has been privileged in Europe and the Americas, just as Islam has been privileged in the Middle East and parts of the Far East, and that privilege is fading here in Western Europe, along with their power base. Reminders of that, and the loss of their standing as the only source of morality and, indeed, any challenge to their beliefs, do not go down too well with many of them.

That's one of those conversations that you *know* you shouldn't have but occasionally cannot rise above then, after banging your head repeatedly against a brick wall, you remember why you shouldn't...

What makes it worse is that I avoided reading the post that started it all, because the person who wrote it had turned off comments, and I can't be bothered with that.

However, a mutual atheist friend did read the post, and replied very sensibly on her LJ. This provoked several responses from the original poster, including one that I felt I had to comment on, primarily because the poster was basically telling all atheists to shut up because we might offend someone and, to be fair, that he ought to shut up too, he supposed. That provoked responses from others, including a couple of very interesting arguments - until there came this accusation of persecution.

I'll be sure to stop mentioning that in public the very minute churches stop attempting to influence laws on matters pertaining to science, drug policies and abortion.

What a load of bollocks. It's as much my right of free speech to poke fun and laugh at their absurd beliefs as it is for them to defend them. But they seem to think they have some sort of automatic right to make us respect their silly beliefs, as opposed to their right to hold them, which is not the same thing at all.

This is the crux of the matter.

If disagreeing with theists about God is persecuting them, then disagreeing with atheists about God is persecuting us.

I have a great idea; let's *all* stop persecuting! We'll stop mentioning God at all, ever, to anyone. Not people who agree with us, not people who disagree with us, not our kids, no one. Mutual non-persecution.

It will be treat.

(arrg--I meant "It will be great.") Hit post too quickly.

Oh just worked out what a Gnu atheist is.

Aren't they just the same as old atheists, really? It's still the same old old arguments.

An open-source, sorry, free-godware atheist, right? :)

One of my favorite responses to attempts to convert me is, "I'm sorry, I don't believe in the occult." This usually allows me to make my escape while they're still spluttering.

Ina was, a very long time ago, a a friend's place doing a tarot reading when evangelists (probably JWs) knocked at the door. Said friend was having trouble getting rid of them. According to Ina she, wearing a black kaftan which helped the effect, and waving the tarot cards, waltzed into the hall demanding, in a loud voice, what her friend had done with the black cockerel.

Another friend used to invite them in to 'discuss the bible' then produce her demotic Greek New Testament and ask them if they wished her to translate...

I took heart from the interesting fact that when the Authonomy admin asked for any stories about angels on the site yesterday, the answer was none.

Two years ago, you couldn't move for them.

Are you suggesting burning Theists alive? No?

No offence, Lil, but you're bloody crap at persecution. Must try harder...

And that's as someone on theist lines. (logically, god seems like a ridiculous concept. unfortunately, logically so does quantum physics - even according to physicists! So I have problems with purely logical arguments, especially as I find the universe in general impossible to accept or believe in.)

Nope. Not even hanging, drawing and quartering. They don't even have to read my posts being rude about Islam or the Pope or creationists.

I offend them by linking to "Jesus and Mo" or Greta Christina. I offend them by saying that I don't shut up because someone is offended.

You aren't trying to impose the Middle Ages on the 21st century. You aren't even trying to get other people to believe in your religion. You don't complain when I complain about people who do. That makes you great in my book.

Don't say that my imaginary friend might not be real!

And don't ever, ever poke fun at him!

"Gnu atheists"
Hee. Would those be converts to Android? Because Linux is the One True OS!
*eyes shiftily* Or are you Windows practitioners?
You'll burn in Silicon Hell!

"Gnu atheists" are indeed, shifty, as they are shifting to this meaningless phrase from the equally meaningless "New atheists".

I already burn in silicon hell, m'dear.

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